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Re: (erielack) Duplexes, Triplexes, Articulateds and so on -- OT?
Well, it's a little more complicated than that. Axle loading is just one parameter in any steam locomotive design, and a design which allows "more" locomotive to be built for a given axle loading is generally advantageous no matter what axle loading a line will tolerate. Or, to put it another way, if the Garratt design will allow "North American-sized" locomotives to operate in Africa, it would have allowed some real monsters to operate on this continent. Considering that it would have competed (in design terms) against UP Big Boys, NP Yellowstones, and Alleghenies, that's not so far fetched.
As for "not invented here", I found that at one time Baldwin licensed the Garratt patent. I don't have a date for this, but I suspect it was during what I call Baldwin's "crazy period", when they were building 2-10-10-2's, locomotives with flexible (accordion-style!) boilers, and seriously designing quadruplex locomotives (a 2-8-8-8-8-2, anyone?) The main client for this insanity was the AT&SF, who was for a period of years, more receptive to experimental design than other US Class 1 railroads. I can't help but observe that ATSF was the Erie's "Western Partner", and came closest of all the western lines to emulating the Erie's generous clearances.
Some years later, the US license for the Garratt patents wound up in ALCO's hands. There are images on the net of ALCO promotional material ca. 1934, touting the benefits of the Garratt design, and depicting an Algerian Garratt that set some speed records for the type. There was also a Beyer-Garratt patent for a "Super Garratt" or "Mallet Garratt", and an accompanying drawing of a 2-6-6-0+0-6-6-2 that was intended for a 3' 6" gauge railway. That would have developed over 200,000 lbs of tractive effort, quite an accomplishment for a NG locomotive (or any locomotive, for that matter)!
I know I have read, but can't remember where, that ALCO designers considered their own "Mallet Garratts" for the US market. The largest of these designs, as I recall, was a 4-8-8-4+4-8-8-4 "Double Big Boy". But no part of this effort ever left the drawing board.
There is, to my knowledge, only one Garratt that has ever operated in the US, and that's a transplanted African NG locomotive running on a private (hobby!) layout an hour and a half from my house in Texas. It must be nice to be wealthy enough to afford your own 12":1' scale railroad! This is known as the Hempstead and Northern Railroad. Despite what you may see on the net, it is not a real commercial railroad, and no locomotives were ever designed by any locomotive manufacturer to run on it.
Now, let's consider the list aspect of this. Garratt's are fascinating mechanically, but the Erie and DL&W never needed locomotives as large as the last generation of US mallets, anyway, having dieselized early. Perhaps if they did, we might have memories of an Erie 2-6-6-6 or something like that, but we don't. The development and adoption of the Lima Superpower concept is an equally fascinating part of steam locomotive design history, and the Erie Berkshires were an important part of that story. As much as I'd like to be able to visit an Erie 2-8-4+4-8-2 "Double Berkshire" Garratt in some museum somewhere, it didn't happen, wasn't that likely to have ever happened, and likely never will happen unless some fabulously wealthy individual blows a significant part of his fortune on steam fantasies. I'm not holding my breath.
Jeff Larson
ELHS #2583
- -----Original Message-----
From: bob gillis <robertgillis_@_verizon.net>
Cc: EL Mailing List <erielack_@_lists.elhts.org>
Sent: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:45:58 -0400
Subject: Re: (erielack) Duplexes, Triplexes, Articulateds and so on -- OT?
The Beyer-Garratt locomotive was invented in 1907 per wikipedia at: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garratt. Read the parts o advantages and disadvantages.
I think the main advantages of low axle loading and flexibility were not required in the USA and the two full pressure flexible steam pipes and no compounding offset any advantages.
Adn of course when they bcame popular elsewwhere, in the USA "they weren't invented here".
bob gillis
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